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	<title>Comments for abstratt: news from the front</title>
	<atom:link href="http://abstratt.com/blog/comments/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://abstratt.com/blog</link>
	<description>A company obsessed with one single goal: stopping people from writing so much code</description>
	<pubDate>Sat, 05 Jul 2008 17:07:54 +0000</pubDate>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=2.5.1</generator>
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		<title>Comment on Time&#8217;s up by rafael.chaves</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/07/01/times-up/#comment-100</link>
		<dc:creator>rafael.chaves</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Jul 2008 06:07:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/?p=93#comment-100</guid>
		<description>Ok, the wiki is back working with images again. The Pet Store Example model is showing fine now, but with no descriptive text whatsoever, which is yet to be written.

Also to be done:

&lt;ul&gt;
&lt;li&gt;publishing the new build (RC3/1.0)
&lt;li&gt;publishing the Acceleo modules
&lt;li&gt;writing an article on how to generate code for the Pet Store example
&lt;/ul&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ok, the wiki is back working with images again. The Pet Store Example model is showing fine now, but with no descriptive text whatsoever, which is yet to be written.</p>
<p>Also to be done:</p>
<ul>
<li>publishing the new build (RC3/1.0)
</li>
<li>publishing the Acceleo modules
</li>
<li>writing an article on how to generate code for the Pet Store example
</li>
</ul>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on Time&#8217;s up by June is over (1 days to go) &#124; Mike on Software</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/07/01/times-up/#comment-98</link>
		<dc:creator>June is over (1 days to go) &#124; Mike on Software</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Jul 2008 14:24:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/?p=93#comment-98</guid>
		<description>[...] and so has Philip (misvCRM) and Project Iffy. Others have checked in with status updates such as Rafael,  Susan,and the Runimal [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] and so has Philip (misvCRM) and Project Iffy. Others have checked in with status updates such as Rafael,  Susan,and the Runimal [...]</p>
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	<item>
		<title>Comment on Time&#8217;s up by Scott Kane</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/07/01/times-up/#comment-97</link>
		<dc:creator>Scott Kane</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 Jul 2008 11:13:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/?p=93#comment-97</guid>
		<description>Hi Rafael,

Feel good about your decision, it's better to be cautious than flippant when releasing a product people are expected to pay for.  Like yourself I've not gone to release, though technically finished I have a lot of code polish I am not confortable shipping without doing first.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Rafael,</p>
<p>Feel good about your decision, it&#8217;s better to be cautious than flippant when releasing a product people are expected to pay for.  Like yourself I&#8217;ve not gone to release, though technically finished I have a lot of code polish I am not confortable shipping without doing first.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on TextUML Toolkit - Commitments for the 30 day challenge by Scope cutting season &#124; abstratt: news from the front</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/06/04/textuml-toolkit-commitments-for-the-30-day-challenge/#comment-96</link>
		<dc:creator>Scope cutting season &#124; abstratt: news from the front</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 24 Jun 2008 15:13:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/06/04/textuml-toolkit-commitments-for-the-30-day-challenge/#comment-96</guid>
		<description>[...] finally woke up to the fact I am really late with most of the deliverables I planned for June 30th and we are already a week from the deadline. I decided thus to postpone all non-product related [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] finally woke up to the fact I am really late with most of the deliverables I planned for June 30th and we are already a week from the deadline. I decided thus to postpone all non-product related [...]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on TextUML Toolkit - Commitments for the 30 day challenge by abstratt: news from the front &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Moving forward again</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/06/04/textuml-toolkit-commitments-for-the-30-day-challenge/#comment-92</link>
		<dc:creator>abstratt: news from the front &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Moving forward again</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Jun 2008 08:58:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/06/04/textuml-toolkit-commitments-for-the-30-day-challenge/#comment-92</guid>
		<description>[...] I finally figured out what was preventing me from exporting the product from Eclipse and worked around the problem. So the TextUML Toolkit RC1 is finally available for download, 4 days after planned. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] I finally figured out what was preventing me from exporting the product from Eclipse and worked around the problem. So the TextUML Toolkit RC1 is finally available for download, 4 days after planned. [...]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>Comment on The bleeding edge: not for the faint of heart by &#187; The bleeding edge: not for the faint of heart A Side: What The World Is Saying About A Side</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/06/18/the-bleeding-edge-not-for-the-faint-of-heart/#comment-94</link>
		<dc:creator>&#187; The bleeding edge: not for the faint of heart A Side: What The World Is Saying About A Side</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Jun 2008 12:16:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/06/18/the-bleeding-edge-not-for-the-faint-of-heart/#comment-94</guid>
		<description>[...] The bleeding edge: not for the faint of heart Eclipse as a platform for embedded and server-side applications, or &#8230; But, this time around I am… …on the other side of the fence [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] The bleeding edge: not for the faint of heart Eclipse as a platform for embedded and server-side applications, or &#8230; But, this time around I am… …on the other side of the fence [...]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on TextUML Toolkit - Layout control for class diagrams by abstratt: news from the front &#187; Blog Archive &#187; The bleeding edge: not for the faint of heart</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/06/11/textuml-toolkit-layout-control-for-class-diagrams/#comment-93</link>
		<dc:creator>abstratt: news from the front &#187; Blog Archive &#187; The bleeding edge: not for the faint of heart</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Jun 2008 08:41:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/06/11/textuml-toolkit-layout-control-for-class-diagrams/#comment-93</guid>
		<description>[...] abstratt: news from the front A company obsessed with one single goal: stopping people from writing so much code.      &#171; TextUML Toolkit - Layout control for class diagrams [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] abstratt: news from the front A company obsessed with one single goal: stopping people from writing so much code.      &laquo; TextUML Toolkit - Layout control for class diagrams [...]</p>
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	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on UML modes and tools by abstratt: news from the front &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Full code generation from UML class, state and activity diagrams</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/05/12/uml-modes-and-tools/#comment-6</link>
		<dc:creator>abstratt: news from the front &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Full code generation from UML class, state and activity diagrams</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Jun 2008 04:30:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/05/12/uml-modes-and-tools/#comment-6</guid>
		<description>[...] using the object-oriented paradigm. People use UML in many different ways (see the post on UML modes), ranging from as a communication tool to as a full fledged programming language that supports full [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] using the object-oriented paradigm. People use UML in many different ways (see the post on UML modes), ranging from as a communication tool to as a full fledged programming language that supports full [...]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>Comment on A detour from a detour from a detour&#8230; (or how a graphical viewing framework for Eclipse was born) by abstratt: news from the front &#187; Blog Archive &#187; TextUML Toolkit - Layout control for class diagrams</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/08/23/a-detour-from-a-detour-from-a-detour-or-how-a-graphical-viewing-framework-for-eclipse-was-born/#comment-29</link>
		<dc:creator>abstratt: news from the front &#187; Blog Archive &#187; TextUML Toolkit - Layout control for class diagrams</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 06:42:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/08/23/a-detour-from-a-detour-from-a-detour-or-how-a-graphical-viewing-framework-for-eclipse-was-born/#comment-29</guid>
		<description>[...] some improvements in the graphical visualization of UML models in EclipseGraphviz. EclipseGraphviz (a spin-off of the TextUML Toolkit) is an open source component (EPL) that integrates Graphviz into Eclipse, [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] some improvements in the graphical visualization of UML models in EclipseGraphviz. EclipseGraphviz (a spin-off of the TextUML Toolkit) is an open source component (EPL) that integrates Graphviz into Eclipse, [...]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on TextUML Toolkit - Commitments for the 30 day challenge by abstratt: news from the front &#187; Blog Archive &#187; TextUML Toolkit - Layout control for class diagrams</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/06/04/textuml-toolkit-commitments-for-the-30-day-challenge/#comment-86</link>
		<dc:creator>abstratt: news from the front &#187; Blog Archive &#187; TextUML Toolkit - Layout control for class diagrams</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jun 2008 06:41:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/06/04/textuml-toolkit-commitments-for-the-30-day-challenge/#comment-86</guid>
		<description>[...] to my original intention of working this week on code generation and the sample application, I have been doing some [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] to my original intention of working this week on code generation and the sample application, I have been doing some [...]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>Comment on TextUML Toolkit - Commitments for the 30 day challenge by abstratt: news from the front &#187; Blog Archive &#187; TextUML Toolkit - Progress on the sample application - TextUML Toolkit, UML, MDA and software engineering</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/06/04/textuml-toolkit-commitments-for-the-30-day-challenge/#comment-88</link>
		<dc:creator>abstratt: news from the front &#187; Blog Archive &#187; TextUML Toolkit - Progress on the sample application - TextUML Toolkit, UML, MDA and software engineering</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Jun 2008 07:49:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/06/04/textuml-toolkit-commitments-for-the-30-day-challenge/#comment-88</guid>
		<description>[...] a first stab at creating the model for the sample application for the TextUML Toolkit, which, as I wrote here before, is derived from Sun&#8217;s Java Pet Store application. Take a look at the models, and let [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] a first stab at creating the model for the sample application for the TextUML Toolkit, which, as I wrote here before, is derived from Sun&#8217;s Java Pet Store application. Take a look at the models, and let [...]</p>
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	<item>
		<title>Comment on TextUML Toolkit - Commitments for the 30 day challenge by rchaves</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/06/04/textuml-toolkit-commitments-for-the-30-day-challenge/#comment-87</link>
		<dc:creator>rchaves</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Jun 2008 02:39:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/06/04/textuml-toolkit-commitments-for-the-30-day-challenge/#comment-87</guid>
		<description>Hi Mike, thanks!

The TextUML Toolkit relies on &lt;a href="http://wiki.eclipse.org/MDT-UML2" rel="nofollow"&gt;Eclipse UML2&lt;/a&gt;, an open source API for reading and manipulating UML models.  Eclipse UML2 persists models in &lt;a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/XMI" rel="nofollow"&gt;XMI&lt;/a&gt;, which is the standard XML-based interchange format for UML. Most UML tools in the market support XMI, including (to my surprise) &lt;a href="http://www.google.com/search?q=Visio+XMI" rel="nofollow"&gt;Visio&lt;/a&gt;.

Unfortunately, there are quite a few different flavors of XMI implementations, causing tools to be incompatible with each other. I haven't tried accessing from the TextUML Toolkit a UML model exported from Visio, but I would be surprised if it works.

The TextUML Toolkit is supposed to be compatible with any of the tools listed &lt;a href="http://wiki.eclipse.org/MDT-UML2-Tool-Compatibility" rel="nofollow"&gt;here&lt;/a&gt;, as they also rely on Eclipse UML2 for importing and/or exporting UML models.

Good luck to you too!

Rafael</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Mike, thanks!</p>
<p>The TextUML Toolkit relies on <a href="http://wiki.eclipse.org/MDT-UML2" rel="nofollow">Eclipse UML2</a>, an open source API for reading and manipulating UML models.  Eclipse UML2 persists models in <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/XMI" rel="nofollow">XMI</a>, which is the standard XML-based interchange format for UML. Most UML tools in the market support XMI, including (to my surprise) <a href="http://www.google.com/search?q=Visio+XMI" rel="nofollow">Visio</a>.</p>
<p>Unfortunately, there are quite a few different flavors of XMI implementations, causing tools to be incompatible with each other. I haven&#8217;t tried accessing from the TextUML Toolkit a UML model exported from Visio, but I would be surprised if it works.</p>
<p>The TextUML Toolkit is supposed to be compatible with any of the tools listed <a href="http://wiki.eclipse.org/MDT-UML2-Tool-Compatibility" rel="nofollow">here</a>, as they also rely on Eclipse UML2 for importing and/or exporting UML models.</p>
<p>Good luck to you too!</p>
<p>Rafael</p>
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	<item>
		<title>Comment on TextUML Toolkit - Commitments for the 30 day challenge by Mike Wilson</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/06/04/textuml-toolkit-commitments-for-the-30-day-challenge/#comment-91</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike Wilson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 05 Jun 2008 16:22:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/06/04/textuml-toolkit-commitments-for-the-30-day-challenge/#comment-91</guid>
		<description>Hi Rafael,

Best of luck with your application. I'm looking forward to seeing how you go with this. Do you think you'll offer any support for GUI design tools such as Visio in the future?

Cheers,

Mike</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Rafael,</p>
<p>Best of luck with your application. I&#8217;m looking forward to seeing how you go with this. Do you think you&#8217;ll offer any support for GUI design tools such as Visio in the future?</p>
<p>Cheers,</p>
<p>Mike</p>
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	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on TextUML Toolkit - Commitments for the 30 day challenge by rchaves</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/06/04/textuml-toolkit-commitments-for-the-30-day-challenge/#comment-90</link>
		<dc:creator>rchaves</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 05 Jun 2008 02:05:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/06/04/textuml-toolkit-commitments-for-the-30-day-challenge/#comment-90</guid>
		<description>:)

Thanks, Andreas, I appreciate the support.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p> <img src='http://abstratt.com/blog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /><br />
Thanks, Andreas, I appreciate the support.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>Comment on TextUML Toolkit - Commitments for the 30 day challenge by Andreas</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/06/04/textuml-toolkit-commitments-for-the-30-day-challenge/#comment-89</link>
		<dc:creator>Andreas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Jun 2008 19:41:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/06/04/textuml-toolkit-commitments-for-the-30-day-challenge/#comment-89</guid>
		<description>Hi Rafael,

who's the other one?
Just kidding...
Anyway. I'm WATCHING you.
Feel the pressure?

Good luck &#38; have fun,
Andreas</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Rafael,</p>
<p>who&#8217;s the other one?<br />
Just kidding&#8230;<br />
Anyway. I&#8217;m WATCHING you.<br />
Feel the pressure?</p>
<p>Good luck &amp; have fun,<br />
Andreas</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on 30-day challenge: the road to TextUML Toolkit 1.0 by abstratt: news from the front &#187; Blog Archive &#187; TextUML Toolkit - Commitments for the 30 day challenge - TextUML Toolkit, UML, MDA and software engineering</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/05/30/30-day-challenge-the-road-to-textuml-toolkit-10/#comment-75</link>
		<dc:creator>abstratt: news from the front &#187; Blog Archive &#187; TextUML Toolkit - Commitments for the 30 day challenge - TextUML Toolkit, UML, MDA and software engineering</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Jun 2008 07:58:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/05/30/30-day-challenge-the-road-to-textuml-toolkit-10/#comment-75</guid>
		<description>[...] I mentioned before, I joined the 30 day product challenge with the TextUML Toolkit. Of the benefits of being part of [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] I mentioned before, I joined the 30 day product challenge with the TextUML Toolkit. Of the benefits of being part of [...]</p>
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		<title>Comment on When UML meets Slashdot&#8230; by rchaves</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/06/02/when-uml-meets-slashdot/#comment-82</link>
		<dc:creator>rchaves</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Jun 2008 06:20:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/06/02/when-uml-meets-slashdot/#comment-82</guid>
		<description>@Everybody:

Please read this post on the UMLforum newsgroup:

http://groups.google.com/group/UMLforum/msg/e55e565ad753721d</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Everybody:</p>
<p>Please read this post on the UMLforum newsgroup:</p>
<p><a href="http://groups.google.com/group/UMLforum/msg/e55e565ad753721d" rel="nofollow">http://groups.google.com/group/UMLforum/msg/e55e565ad753721d</a></p>
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	<item>
		<title>Comment on When UML meets Slashdot&#8230; by rchaves</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/06/02/when-uml-meets-slashdot/#comment-81</link>
		<dc:creator>rchaves</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Jun 2008 06:04:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/06/02/when-uml-meets-slashdot/#comment-81</guid>
		<description>@Neil:

I am big believer in incremental design. UML does not preclude that, actually even facilitates that. Yes, tools that generate code once that you must maintain by hand from there on are a pain. But executable modeling-based tools don't have that caveat because the model is the code.

Executable modeling is still new and not exposed by any of the mainstream UML tools, and thus is not well known. But I am working towards changing that... ;)

BTW, thanks for the link!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Neil:</p>
<p>I am big believer in incremental design. UML does not preclude that, actually even facilitates that. Yes, tools that generate code once that you must maintain by hand from there on are a pain. But executable modeling-based tools don&#8217;t have that caveat because the model is the code.</p>
<p>Executable modeling is still new and not exposed by any of the mainstream UML tools, and thus is not well known. But I am working towards changing that&#8230; <img src='http://abstratt.com/blog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' /><br />
BTW, thanks for the link!</p>
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		<title>Comment on When UML meets Slashdot&#8230; by rchaves</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/06/02/when-uml-meets-slashdot/#comment-80</link>
		<dc:creator>rchaves</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Jun 2008 05:58:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/06/02/when-uml-meets-slashdot/#comment-80</guid>
		<description>@Ed:

EMF is here and can show its usefulness today, and that is great. But we have a long way ahead of us, and a structure-centric approach won't take us far enough. But it is a good step in the right direction. I think I read people are considering a model-based approach for e4. That is awesome, and much/all of the credit for making the Eclipse Platform developers even consider the idea certainly goes to the Ed Merks Framework. ;)

&lt;em&gt;"Make it real, pragmatic, and valuable, and you’ve made it matter. In other words, don’t just say it matters, make it matter…"&lt;/em&gt;

Awesome advice! I think I am working on that!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Ed:</p>
<p>EMF is here and can show its usefulness today, and that is great. But we have a long way ahead of us, and a structure-centric approach won&#8217;t take us far enough. But it is a good step in the right direction. I think I read people are considering a model-based approach for e4. That is awesome, and much/all of the credit for making the Eclipse Platform developers even consider the idea certainly goes to the Ed Merks Framework. <img src='http://abstratt.com/blog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' /><br />
<em>&#8220;Make it real, pragmatic, and valuable, and you’ve made it matter. In other words, don’t just say it matters, make it matter…&#8221;</em></p>
<p>Awesome advice! I think I am working on that!</p>
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		<title>Comment on When UML meets Slashdot&#8230; by rchaves</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/06/02/when-uml-meets-slashdot/#comment-79</link>
		<dc:creator>rchaves</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Jun 2008 05:50:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/06/02/when-uml-meets-slashdot/#comment-79</guid>
		<description>@Jiles:

Yes, UML is huge. It grew from a unified notation that combined the pre-existing OMT, Booch and OOSE approaches to a multi-paradigm executable modeling language. It does suffer from trying to be everything to everybody.

But nobody says you must use all of its features. There are many uses of UML, and the trick is in recognizing what is relevant and what must be ignored.

&lt;em&gt;"MDA as such is interesting but I think at this point, it is very clear it is only usable in very specific and stable domains. "&lt;/em&gt;

I would say more than 50% of the applications out there involve implementing simple business logic and database-based persistence. That is clearly an excellent target for MDD.  Why hasn't it picked up yet? My bet is that the tool providers that support feature-rich MDD are just not interested in that market if they cannot charge 100K+ for their tool suite (as they do in the telecom and embedded industry).

&lt;em&gt;people like Martin Fowler point out that UML might not be the best tool for this particular job even&lt;/em&gt;

I truly admire Martin Fowler for his many contributions, but I strongly believe he is completely off (and as are other luminaries, such as Dave "Bedarra" Thomas) when it comes to UML and MDD.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Jiles:</p>
<p>Yes, UML is huge. It grew from a unified notation that combined the pre-existing OMT, Booch and OOSE approaches to a multi-paradigm executable modeling language. It does suffer from trying to be everything to everybody.</p>
<p>But nobody says you must use all of its features. There are many uses of UML, and the trick is in recognizing what is relevant and what must be ignored.</p>
<p><em>&#8220;MDA as such is interesting but I think at this point, it is very clear it is only usable in very specific and stable domains. &#8220;</em></p>
<p>I would say more than 50% of the applications out there involve implementing simple business logic and database-based persistence. That is clearly an excellent target for MDD.  Why hasn&#8217;t it picked up yet? My bet is that the tool providers that support feature-rich MDD are just not interested in that market if they cannot charge 100K+ for their tool suite (as they do in the telecom and embedded industry).</p>
<p><em>people like Martin Fowler point out that UML might not be the best tool for this particular job even</em></p>
<p>I truly admire Martin Fowler for his many contributions, but I strongly believe he is completely off (and as are other luminaries, such as Dave &#8220;Bedarra&#8221; Thomas) when it comes to UML and MDD.</p>
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		<title>Comment on When UML meets Slashdot&#8230; by rchaves</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/06/02/when-uml-meets-slashdot/#comment-78</link>
		<dc:creator>rchaves</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Jun 2008 05:33:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/06/02/when-uml-meets-slashdot/#comment-78</guid>
		<description>@Doug:

&lt;em&gt;"One also has to question whether model-driven development itself is the right paradigm"&lt;/em&gt;

True. I would not want to write an OS, or Eclipse itself, using UML and MDD. But most of the code being currently being written in Java out there (i.e. business applications) is &lt;b&gt;built at the wrong level of abstraction&lt;/b&gt;, and this is why even though we have been doing that for decades, we still suck at doing it. Gosh, I think even Cobol was more appropriate than the Java-based solutions currently in use.

&lt;em&gt;"Start over, if it’s not tool late and make a real executable modeling language."&lt;/em&gt;

If a better executable modeling language is born, I will be happy to move to it.  Must-have requirements: high-level of abstraction, not owned by a company, backed by a solid metamodel, syntax agnostic, solid open source reference implementation. Oh, I guess it will help if I can translate back and forth to UML.

Hey, I think I just described UML.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Doug:</p>
<p><em>&#8220;One also has to question whether model-driven development itself is the right paradigm&#8221;</em></p>
<p>True. I would not want to write an OS, or Eclipse itself, using UML and MDD. But most of the code being currently being written in Java out there (i.e. business applications) is <b>built at the wrong level of abstraction</b>, and this is why even though we have been doing that for decades, we still suck at doing it. Gosh, I think even Cobol was more appropriate than the Java-based solutions currently in use.</p>
<p><em>&#8220;Start over, if it’s not tool late and make a real executable modeling language.&#8221;</em></p>
<p>If a better executable modeling language is born, I will be happy to move to it.  Must-have requirements: high-level of abstraction, not owned by a company, backed by a solid metamodel, syntax agnostic, solid open source reference implementation. Oh, I guess it will help if I can translate back and forth to UML.</p>
<p>Hey, I think I just described UML.</p>
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		<title>Comment on When UML meets Slashdot&#8230; by Ed Merks</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/06/02/when-uml-meets-slashdot/#comment-84</link>
		<dc:creator>Ed Merks</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Jun 2008 16:12:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/06/02/when-uml-meets-slashdot/#comment-84</guid>
		<description>Anything that gets in the way of iterative design is going to be a tough sell in this increasingly agile world.  Producing diagrams purely for management's gratification is even worse.

I asked someone a few months ago, what are people doing with these fancy UML tools?  Don't they want to generate code?  The answer was that although there is code generation support, mostly people use the tools to draw pretty pictures.   Of course if the quality of the code being generated is poor, and worse yet, if it doesn't support iterative development, the pictures about about the most valuable thing you get.

It makes me sad and helps remind me to focus on practical things that matter to real developers.  It's quite easy to map UML to Ecore and thereby to extract significant value from the investment.  It's also easy to go in the other direction too, if someone is in need of gratuitous gratification...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Anything that gets in the way of iterative design is going to be a tough sell in this increasingly agile world.  Producing diagrams purely for management&#8217;s gratification is even worse.</p>
<p>I asked someone a few months ago, what are people doing with these fancy UML tools?  Don&#8217;t they want to generate code?  The answer was that although there is code generation support, mostly people use the tools to draw pretty pictures.   Of course if the quality of the code being generated is poor, and worse yet, if it doesn&#8217;t support iterative development, the pictures about about the most valuable thing you get.</p>
<p>It makes me sad and helps remind me to focus on practical things that matter to real developers.  It&#8217;s quite easy to map UML to Ecore and thereby to extract significant value from the investment.  It&#8217;s also easy to go in the other direction too, if someone is in need of gratuitous gratification&#8230;</p>
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		<title>Comment on When UML meets Slashdot&#8230; by neil</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/06/02/when-uml-meets-slashdot/#comment-83</link>
		<dc:creator>neil</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Jun 2008 13:51:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/06/02/when-uml-meets-slashdot/#comment-83</guid>
		<description>Slashdot hating aside, I have to second Doug's comment. I'm not sure that the *graphical* nature of UML is the problem ... I think it's resistance to so-called 'big design up front'. Many developers seem to have had the same negative experiences with modeling and documentation that is only done to appease a manager or client.

That said, I would like to see more studies on how UML is used in industry. My current understanding is that it has an optimistic 40% usage rate (mostly for communication, I would think).

See http://amazinnggg.blogspot.com/2006/11/uml-usage.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Slashdot hating aside, I have to second Doug&#8217;s comment. I&#8217;m not sure that the *graphical* nature of UML is the problem &#8230; I think it&#8217;s resistance to so-called &#8216;big design up front&#8217;. Many developers seem to have had the same negative experiences with modeling and documentation that is only done to appease a manager or client.</p>
<p>That said, I would like to see more studies on how UML is used in industry. My current understanding is that it has an optimistic 40% usage rate (mostly for communication, I would think).</p>
<p>See <a href="http://amazinnggg.blogspot.com/2006/11/uml-usage.html" rel="nofollow">http://amazinnggg.blogspot.com/2006/11/uml-usage.html</a></p>
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		<title>Comment on When UML meets Slashdot&#8230; by Ed Merks</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/06/02/when-uml-meets-slashdot/#comment-77</link>
		<dc:creator>Ed Merks</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Jun 2008 12:30:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/06/02/when-uml-meets-slashdot/#comment-77</guid>
		<description>Where some see models but others see only code, I see tend to see the models in the code  Of course some will ague my model-based perspective is narrow, but I believe the contrary to be true, i.e., a code-only perspective is narrow.  So to me the question of whether model-driven development is the right paradigm is simply not seeing the forest for all the trees and their bark beetles.  When you define an interface A with a method getX, you've defined a model of your data.  As such, whether folks feel as if they are modeling or not, much of what they do is in fact modeling their data.  It simply doesn't matter whether they have rat body parts to spare.  EMF lets you quite easily define a model using Java and of course we could make it far easier given resources levels like those that go into JDT.

In any case, I personally  have grave concerns about formalisms such as UML and XML Schema that seem to be complex in a way that is far beyond the mental capacity of the average human being.   That being said, I believe simplicity is an illusion that hides intrinsic complexity behind intuition and deep understanding.

My personal ambition is to ensure that EMF's pragmatic approach to model driven development solves real every day problems so that it can be used to build simple applications or even monstrously complex things like UML and XML Schema.  Rather than argue from up on a soapbox about the virtues MDD, I'd rather spend my time addressing limitations that impede real programmers in their daily lives; although I do love a good strong soapbox.  Make it real, pragmatic, and valuable, and you've made it matter. In other words, don't just say it matters, make it matter...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Where some see models but others see only code, I see tend to see the models in the code  Of course some will ague my model-based perspective is narrow, but I believe the contrary to be true, i.e., a code-only perspective is narrow.  So to me the question of whether model-driven development is the right paradigm is simply not seeing the forest for all the trees and their bark beetles.  When you define an interface A with a method getX, you&#8217;ve defined a model of your data.  As such, whether folks feel as if they are modeling or not, much of what they do is in fact modeling their data.  It simply doesn&#8217;t matter whether they have rat body parts to spare.  EMF lets you quite easily define a model using Java and of course we could make it far easier given resources levels like those that go into JDT.</p>
<p>In any case, I personally  have grave concerns about formalisms such as UML and XML Schema that seem to be complex in a way that is far beyond the mental capacity of the average human being.   That being said, I believe simplicity is an illusion that hides intrinsic complexity behind intuition and deep understanding.</p>
<p>My personal ambition is to ensure that EMF&#8217;s pragmatic approach to model driven development solves real every day problems so that it can be used to build simple applications or even monstrously complex things like UML and XML Schema.  Rather than argue from up on a soapbox about the virtues MDD, I&#8217;d rather spend my time addressing limitations that impede real programmers in their daily lives; although I do love a good strong soapbox.  Make it real, pragmatic, and valuable, and you&#8217;ve made it matter. In other words, don&#8217;t just say it matters, make it matter&#8230;</p>
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		<title>Comment on When UML meets Slashdot&#8230; by Jilles</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/06/02/when-uml-meets-slashdot/#comment-76</link>
		<dc:creator>Jilles</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Jun 2008 08:28:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/06/02/when-uml-meets-slashdot/#comment-76</guid>
		<description>UML is not misunderstood but yet another over engineered silver bullet. It's had over ten years to prove itself in industry and it's just not working as advertised by UML tool vendors and other proponents. Sure there are success stories and some areas where it actually is useful but in the vast majority of UML tool deployments the added value is dubious at best and the dogmatic reasoning that put it in place can be qualified as misguided.

MDA as such is interesting but I think at this point, it is very clear it is only usable in very specific and stable domains. Additionally people like Martin Fowler point out that UML might not be the best tool for this particular job even.

To be fair, I think UML was doomed the day the OMG got involved. I think OMG has a long track record proving that design by committee leads to bloated, over engineered compromises.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>UML is not misunderstood but yet another over engineered silver bullet. It&#8217;s had over ten years to prove itself in industry and it&#8217;s just not working as advertised by UML tool vendors and other proponents. Sure there are success stories and some areas where it actually is useful but in the vast majority of UML tool deployments the added value is dubious at best and the dogmatic reasoning that put it in place can be qualified as misguided.</p>
<p>MDA as such is interesting but I think at this point, it is very clear it is only usable in very specific and stable domains. Additionally people like Martin Fowler point out that UML might not be the best tool for this particular job even.</p>
<p>To be fair, I think UML was doomed the day the OMG got involved. I think OMG has a long track record proving that design by committee leads to bloated, over engineered compromises.</p>
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		<title>Comment on When UML meets Slashdot&#8230; by Doug Schaefer</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/06/02/when-uml-meets-slashdot/#comment-85</link>
		<dc:creator>Doug Schaefer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Jun 2008 07:07:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/06/02/when-uml-meets-slashdot/#comment-85</guid>
		<description>One also has to question whether model-driven development itself is the right paradigm. Yes, UML is the most popular in that domain, but I wonder what percentage of software developers give a rats you know what about modeling at all. If I had to pick between modeling and Eclipse content assist and quick fix, I know what would make me more productive.

And this comes from a guy who spent a good 8 years of his career trying to make modeling matter and gave up along with many a colleague. UML is crap, the tools are even worse. Start over, if it's not tool late and make a real executable modeling language. Oh yeah, we had that with ObjecTime Developer. Thanks, Rational! (ok, I'm a little bitter ;)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>One also has to question whether model-driven development itself is the right paradigm. Yes, UML is the most popular in that domain, but I wonder what percentage of software developers give a rats you know what about modeling at all. If I had to pick between modeling and Eclipse content assist and quick fix, I know what would make me more productive.</p>
<p>And this comes from a guy who spent a good 8 years of his career trying to make modeling matter and gave up along with many a colleague. UML is crap, the tools are even worse. Start over, if it&#8217;s not tool late and make a real executable modeling language. Oh yeah, we had that with ObjecTime Developer. Thanks, Rational! (ok, I&#8217;m a little bitter <img src='http://abstratt.com/blog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' /></p>
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		<title>Comment on UML modes and tools by abstratt: news from the front &#187; Blog Archive &#187; When UML meets Slashdot&#8230; - TextUML Toolkit, UML, MDA and software engineering</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/05/12/uml-modes-and-tools/#comment-22</link>
		<dc:creator>abstratt: news from the front &#187; Blog Archive &#187; When UML meets Slashdot&#8230; - TextUML Toolkit, UML, MDA and software engineering</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Jun 2008 06:28:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/05/12/uml-modes-and-tools/#comment-22</guid>
		<description>[...] as a communication tool as opposed to as a basis for partial or full code generation (see post on UML modes). Many also complain that the graphical notation is cumbersome and that it hurts productivity [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] as a communication tool as opposed to as a basis for partial or full code generation (see post on UML modes). Many also complain that the graphical notation is cumbersome and that it hurts productivity [...]</p>
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		<title>Comment on Where we are coming from - Part III by abstratt: news from the front &#187; Blog Archive &#187; UML modes and tools</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/04/15/where-we-are-coming-from-part-iii/#comment-4</link>
		<dc:creator>abstratt: news from the front &#187; Blog Archive &#187; UML modes and tools</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 17 May 2008 21:49:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/04/15/where-we-are-coming-from-part-iii-final/#comment-4</guid>
		<description>[...] Libra will support this, and when made available will visibly sport a reasonably fair price on our web [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Libra will support this, and when made available will visibly sport a reasonably fair price on our web [...]</p>
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		<title>Comment on &#8220;Why we write code and don&#8217;t just draw diagrams&#8221; by rchaves</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/05/05/why-we-write-code-and-dont-just-draw-diagrams/#comment-72</link>
		<dc:creator>rchaves</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 May 2008 04:46:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/05/05/why-we-write-code-and-dont-just-draw-diagrams/#comment-72</guid>
		<description>Hi Andreas,

Thanks for your comments, glad to hear from you again. You make interesting points, as usual.
&lt;em&gt;
&gt; let’s not forget that the UML defines 13 diagram types
&gt; and TextUML only addresses the class diagram
&gt; (static structure).
&lt;/em&gt;
True. However, even though I can't think of a single UML diagram type for which a textual notation could not at least do the job, supporting them all is &lt;em&gt;not&lt;/em&gt; the goal of the TextUML Toolkit.

The goal is to support &lt;em&gt;enough features&lt;/em&gt; of UML to enable &lt;strong&gt;basic&lt;/strong&gt; (elaboration-style) model-driven development - described in the post on &lt;a href="http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/05/12/uml-modes-and-tools/" rel="nofollow"&gt;UML modes&lt;/a&gt; as &lt;em&gt;UML as blueprint&lt;/em&gt; .

So, yes, the usefulness of the TextUML Toolkit is limited to what you can do if you restrict yourself to modeling structure only. But many (most?) of the code generation tools in the market have the same limitation, and they are quite useful.
&lt;em&gt;
&gt; What about designing and/or documenting complex
&gt; interactions with sequence diagrams?
&gt; A control flow with activity diagrams?
&gt; A state machine with a state machine diagram?
&gt; A system architecture with a deployment diagram?
&lt;/em&gt;
My interest in UML is primarily as a language for model-driven development. That, for starters, excludes diagrams such as use case, sequence, object and communication/collaboration diagrams. Those basically support the UML mode known as &lt;em&gt;UML as draft&lt;/em&gt;.

And even though some other diagrams can be useful in the context of MDD (deployment and package, for instance), they are not really essential.

The only diagrams I think are &lt;em&gt;really&lt;/em&gt; important in the context of model-driven development are the class, activity and state diagrams. Actually, depending on what/how you are building, you can get by with the first (which is the core diagram in UML) and one of the other two.
&lt;em&gt;
&gt; In addition, the static structure of the code is usually
&gt; the “easy part”. The hard part are the dynamics and
&gt; interactions.
&lt;/em&gt;
Totally agree!
&lt;em&gt;
&gt; So - a bit evil minded - I could say that
&gt; TextUML only addresses the parts of a software
&gt; system that cause only a fraction of the overall effort
&gt; of creating a complex software system.
&lt;/em&gt;
You are right if we take into account what you can see in the TextUML Toolkit. But in a larger product I have been working on for quite a while now (I called it &lt;em&gt;Corcova&lt;/em&gt; in the past), which is the sole reason the TextUML Toolkit product exists, you can model activities using (action language-style) TextUML and can do cool things that are only possible if you go beyond the structural aspects (in the spirit of &lt;em&gt;UML as programming language&lt;/em&gt;, mentioned in that &lt;a href="http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/05/12/uml-modes-and-tools/" rel="nofollow"&gt;same post&lt;/a&gt;.

I plan to write in more detail about this sometime this summer, hopefully along with a cool demo! But if you have more questions/comments, I will be glad to exchange more ideas on the subject.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Andreas,</p>
<p>Thanks for your comments, glad to hear from you again. You make interesting points, as usual.<br />
<em><br />
> let’s not forget that the UML defines 13 diagram types<br />
> and TextUML only addresses the class diagram<br />
> (static structure).<br />
</em><br />
True. However, even though I can&#8217;t think of a single UML diagram type for which a textual notation could not at least do the job, supporting them all is <em>not</em> the goal of the TextUML Toolkit.</p>
<p>The goal is to support <em>enough features</em> of UML to enable <strong>basic</strong> (elaboration-style) model-driven development - described in the post on <a href="http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/05/12/uml-modes-and-tools/" rel="nofollow">UML modes</a> as <em>UML as blueprint</em> .</p>
<p>So, yes, the usefulness of the TextUML Toolkit is limited to what you can do if you restrict yourself to modeling structure only. But many (most?) of the code generation tools in the market have the same limitation, and they are quite useful.<br />
<em><br />
> What about designing and/or documenting complex<br />
> interactions with sequence diagrams?<br />
> A control flow with activity diagrams?<br />
> A state machine with a state machine diagram?<br />
> A system architecture with a deployment diagram?<br />
</em><br />
My interest in UML is primarily as a language for model-driven development. That, for starters, excludes diagrams such as use case, sequence, object and communication/collaboration diagrams. Those basically support the UML mode known as <em>UML as draft</em>.</p>
<p>And even though some other diagrams can be useful in the context of MDD (deployment and package, for instance), they are not really essential.</p>
<p>The only diagrams I think are <em>really</em> important in the context of model-driven development are the class, activity and state diagrams. Actually, depending on what/how you are building, you can get by with the first (which is the core diagram in UML) and one of the other two.<br />
<em><br />
> In addition, the static structure of the code is usually<br />
> the “easy part”. The hard part are the dynamics and<br />
> interactions.<br />
</em><br />
Totally agree!<br />
<em><br />
> So - a bit evil minded - I could say that<br />
> TextUML only addresses the parts of a software<br />
> system that cause only a fraction of the overall effort<br />
> of creating a complex software system.<br />
</em><br />
You are right if we take into account what you can see in the TextUML Toolkit. But in a larger product I have been working on for quite a while now (I called it <em>Corcova</em> in the past), which is the sole reason the TextUML Toolkit product exists, you can model activities using (action language-style) TextUML and can do cool things that are only possible if you go beyond the structural aspects (in the spirit of <em>UML as programming language</em>, mentioned in that <a href="http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/05/12/uml-modes-and-tools/" rel="nofollow">same post</a>.</p>
<p>I plan to write in more detail about this sometime this summer, hopefully along with a cool demo! But if you have more questions/comments, I will be glad to exchange more ideas on the subject.</p>
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		<title>Comment on &#8220;Why we write code and don&#8217;t just draw diagrams&#8221; by Andreas</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/05/05/why-we-write-code-and-dont-just-draw-diagrams/#comment-73</link>
		<dc:creator>Andreas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 May 2008 20:03:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/05/05/why-we-write-code-and-dont-just-draw-diagrams/#comment-73</guid>
		<description>Hello Rafael,

let's not forget that the UML defines 13 diagram types and TextUML only addresses the class diagram (static structure).
What about designing and/or documenting complex interactions with sequence diagrams?
A control flow with activity diagrams?
A state machine with a state machine diagram?
A system architecture with a deployment diagram?
While the static structure of a software system is relatively easy to grasp (anyway, the first thing I do when looking at new code is run Doxygen on it and look at the nice diagrams generated from the code) the dynamic aspects are deeply hidden in code and they can be very hard to discover. A current diagram with the right abstraction level can give you more insight than weeks of reading code.
In addition, the static structure of the code is usually the "easy part". The hard part are the dynamics and interactions. So - a bit evil minded - I could say that TextUML only addresses the parts of a software system that cause only a fraction of the overall effort of creating a complex software system.

Best regards,
Andreas</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hello Rafael,</p>
<p>let&#8217;s not forget that the UML defines 13 diagram types and TextUML only addresses the class diagram (static structure).<br />
What about designing and/or documenting complex interactions with sequence diagrams?<br />
A control flow with activity diagrams?<br />
A state machine with a state machine diagram?<br />
A system architecture with a deployment diagram?<br />
While the static structure of a software system is relatively easy to grasp (anyway, the first thing I do when looking at new code is run Doxygen on it and look at the nice diagrams generated from the code) the dynamic aspects are deeply hidden in code and they can be very hard to discover. A current diagram with the right abstraction level can give you more insight than weeks of reading code.<br />
In addition, the static structure of the code is usually the &#8220;easy part&#8221;. The hard part are the dynamics and interactions. So - a bit evil minded - I could say that TextUML only addresses the parts of a software system that cause only a fraction of the overall effort of creating a complex software system.</p>
<p>Best regards,<br />
Andreas</p>
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		<title>Comment on TextUML Toolkit M4 test build is now available by abstratt: news from the front &#187; Blog Archive &#187; M4 has left the building!</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/04/28/textuml-toolkit-m4-test-build-is-now-available/#comment-71</link>
		<dc:creator>abstratt: news from the front &#187; Blog Archive &#187; M4 has left the building!</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 May 2008 01:11:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/04/28/textuml-toolkit-m4-test-build-is-now-available/#comment-71</guid>
		<description>[...] has been declared. If you got the M4 test build that was announced a week ago, no need to download again, it is the same build. Please see that post for a summary of the [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] has been declared. If you got the M4 test build that was announced a week ago, no need to download again, it is the same build. Please see that post for a summary of the [...]</p>
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	<item>
		<title>Comment on &#8220;Why we write code and don&#8217;t just draw diagrams&#8221; by rchaves</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/05/05/why-we-write-code-and-dont-just-draw-diagrams/#comment-74</link>
		<dc:creator>rchaves</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 05 May 2008 08:22:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/05/05/why-we-write-code-and-dont-just-draw-diagrams/#comment-74</guid>
		<description>Repercussion on InfoQ:

http://www.infoq.com/news/2007/11/pictures-or-words</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Repercussion on InfoQ:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.infoq.com/news/2007/11/pictures-or-words" rel="nofollow">http://www.infoq.com/news/2007/11/pictures-or-words</a></p>
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	<item>
		<title>Comment on TextUML Toolkit is now available on multiple platforms by rchaves</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/03/03/textuml-toolkit-is-now-available-on-multiple-platforms/#comment-70</link>
		<dc:creator>rchaves</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Apr 2008 14:45:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/03/03/textuml-toolkit-is-now-available-on-multiple-platforms/#comment-70</guid>
		<description>Cool, thanks! If you have any issues or questions, please let me know.

And watch for the next milestone (M4, which will be available by the end of the month), for which the goal is to be complete and solid enough so it is ready for beta testing. It will also integrate a 3rd-party code generator (Acceleo) and a complete example of code generation. Stay tuned!

Rafael</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Cool, thanks! If you have any issues or questions, please let me know.</p>
<p>And watch for the next milestone (M4, which will be available by the end of the month), for which the goal is to be complete and solid enough so it is ready for beta testing. It will also integrate a 3rd-party code generator (Acceleo) and a complete example of code generation. Stay tuned!</p>
<p>Rafael</p>
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	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on TextUML Toolkit is now available on multiple platforms by Michael</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/03/03/textuml-toolkit-is-now-available-on-multiple-platforms/#comment-69</link>
		<dc:creator>Michael</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Apr 2008 13:45:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/03/03/textuml-toolkit-is-now-available-on-multiple-platforms/#comment-69</guid>
		<description>Just downloaded it and installed graphviz (with macports) on my Intel Mac running OSX 10.4. Have had a little play and so far so good !  I really like the concept.  Thanks.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just downloaded it and installed graphviz (with macports) on my Intel Mac running OSX 10.4. Have had a little play and so far so good !  I really like the concept.  Thanks.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on TextUML Toolkit M3 test build is available! by rchaves</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/02/28/textuml-toolkit-m3-test-build-is-available/#comment-68</link>
		<dc:creator>rchaves</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Feb 2008 15:59:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/02/28/textuml-toolkit-m3-test-build-is-available/#comment-68</guid>
		<description>You are right, fixed it. Thanks Nirav!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You are right, fixed it. Thanks Nirav!</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on TextUML Toolkit M3 test build is available! by Nirav Thaker</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/02/28/textuml-toolkit-m3-test-build-is-available/#comment-67</link>
		<dc:creator>Nirav Thaker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Feb 2008 15:05:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2008/02/28/textuml-toolkit-m3-test-build-is-available/#comment-67</guid>
		<description>That "Getting Started with UML2" link seems to be broken http//www.eclipse.org/modeling/mdt/uml2/docs/articles/Getting_Started_with_UML2/article.html

Nice progress. Keep up the good work!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That &#8220;Getting Started with UML2&#8243; link seems to be broken http//www.eclipse.org/modeling/mdt/uml2/docs/articles/Getting_Started_with_UML2/article.html</p>
<p>Nice progress. Keep up the good work!</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>Comment on Eclipse DemoCamp in Vancouver by Mik&#8217;s Blog &#187; Blog Archive &#187; There&#8217;s something about Vancouver</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/12/08/eclipse-democamp-in-vancouver/#comment-54</link>
		<dc:creator>Mik&#8217;s Blog &#187; Blog Archive &#187; There&#8217;s something about Vancouver</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Jan 2008 04:44:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/12/08/eclipse-democamp-in-vancouver/#comment-54</guid>
		<description>[...] Rafael Chaves of Abstratt Technologies presented a new approach to UML editing called TextUML Toolkit. There&#8217;s an interesting discussion on it in Rafael&#8217;s blog. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Rafael Chaves of Abstratt Technologies presented a new approach to UML editing called TextUML Toolkit. There&#8217;s an interesting discussion on it in Rafael&#8217;s blog. [...]</p>
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	<item>
		<title>Comment on A reader&#8217;s &#8220;Thoughts about TextUML&#8221; by rchaves</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/12/18/a-readers-thoughts-about-textuml/#comment-65</link>
		<dc:creator>rchaves</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 30 Dec 2007 19:36:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/12/18/a-readers-thoughts-about-textuml/#comment-65</guid>
		<description>Hi Andreas,

I see now, thanks for clarifying. That is a good point.

As I said above, the focus for the TextUML Toolkit's is code generation, requiring completely defined models (all typed elements must declare a type), and thus it is not ideal for sketching.

But it does not have to be like that. A textual notation could allow incomplete syntax, and thus be appropriate for sketching. I agree that when sketching, we usually are in "picture" mode. However, your sketch of a UML model might eventually evolve into a more complete version suitable for code generation. In that case, if you are a user that bought the idea of textual notation for "formal" modeling, my guess is that you would be fine with using the textual notation while sketching as well (granted, relying heavily on the automatic diagram rendering feature).

Cheers,

Rafael</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Andreas,</p>
<p>I see now, thanks for clarifying. That is a good point.</p>
<p>As I said above, the focus for the TextUML Toolkit&#8217;s is code generation, requiring completely defined models (all typed elements must declare a type), and thus it is not ideal for sketching.</p>
<p>But it does not have to be like that. A textual notation could allow incomplete syntax, and thus be appropriate for sketching. I agree that when sketching, we usually are in &#8220;picture&#8221; mode. However, your sketch of a UML model might eventually evolve into a more complete version suitable for code generation. In that case, if you are a user that bought the idea of textual notation for &#8220;formal&#8221; modeling, my guess is that you would be fine with using the textual notation while sketching as well (granted, relying heavily on the automatic diagram rendering feature).</p>
<p>Cheers,</p>
<p>Rafael</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on A reader&#8217;s &#8220;Thoughts about TextUML&#8221; by Andreas</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/12/18/a-readers-thoughts-about-textuml/#comment-64</link>
		<dc:creator>Andreas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 30 Dec 2007 13:30:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/12/18/a-readers-thoughts-about-textuml/#comment-64</guid>
		<description>Hello all,

seems as if I finally have been confused somewhat in my first comment.
While I wrote
"I don’t think I would achieve the same effect with a *graphical* notation (only)."
I actually meant the opposite
"I don’t think I would achieve the same effect with a *textual* notation (only)."

Sorry &#38; best regards,
Andreas</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hello all,</p>
<p>seems as if I finally have been confused somewhat in my first comment.<br />
While I wrote<br />
&#8220;I don’t think I would achieve the same effect with a *graphical* notation (only).&#8221;<br />
I actually meant the opposite<br />
&#8220;I don’t think I would achieve the same effect with a *textual* notation (only).&#8221;</p>
<p>Sorry &amp; best regards,<br />
Andreas</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on A reader&#8217;s &#8220;Thoughts about TextUML&#8221; by rchaves</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/12/18/a-readers-thoughts-about-textuml/#comment-63</link>
		<dc:creator>rchaves</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Dec 2007 08:25:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/12/18/a-readers-thoughts-about-textuml/#comment-63</guid>
		<description>Hey Andreas,

Maybe surprisingly to you, the TextUML Toolkit would not be a good tool for sketching as it requires well formed models. Please see this post for more on this subject: http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/05/12/uml-modes-and-tools/

Thanks for the pointer to the TMF proposal. That one is much more ambitious as it is a framework for building textual notations for modeling, for multiple metamodels (basically being for textual modeling what &lt;a href="http://www.eclipse.org/gmf/" rel="nofollow"&gt;GMF&lt;/a&gt; is for graphical modeling). The TextUML Toolkit is just a concrete implementation of a specific textual notation for UML.

When/if TMF becomes a reality, the TextUML Toolkit could in theory be retrofitted to be based on TMF. The same considerations are true for the &lt;a href="http://www.eclipse.org/proposals/imp/" rel="nofollow"&gt;IMP&lt;/a&gt; project.

Another project following the same approach (for Ecore-based models) is &lt;a href="http://wiki.eclipse.org/Emfatic" rel="nofollow"&gt;Emfatic&lt;/a&gt;.

Cheers,

Rafael</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey Andreas,</p>
<p>Maybe surprisingly to you, the TextUML Toolkit would not be a good tool for sketching as it requires well formed models. Please see this post for more on this subject: <a href="http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/05/12/uml-modes-and-tools/" rel="nofollow">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/05/12/uml-modes-and-tools/</a></p>
<p>Thanks for the pointer to the TMF proposal. That one is much more ambitious as it is a framework for building textual notations for modeling, for multiple metamodels (basically being for textual modeling what <a href="http://www.eclipse.org/gmf/" rel="nofollow">GMF</a> is for graphical modeling). The TextUML Toolkit is just a concrete implementation of a specific textual notation for UML.</p>
<p>When/if TMF becomes a reality, the TextUML Toolkit could in theory be retrofitted to be based on TMF. The same considerations are true for the <a href="http://www.eclipse.org/proposals/imp/" rel="nofollow">IMP</a> project.</p>
<p>Another project following the same approach (for Ecore-based models) is <a href="http://wiki.eclipse.org/Emfatic" rel="nofollow">Emfatic</a>.</p>
<p>Cheers,</p>
<p>Rafael</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on A reader&#8217;s &#8220;Thoughts about TextUML&#8221; by Andreas</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/12/18/a-readers-thoughts-about-textuml/#comment-66</link>
		<dc:creator>Andreas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 18 Dec 2007 21:26:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/12/18/a-readers-thoughts-about-textuml/#comment-66</guid>
		<description>Hello Rafael,

thanks for your appreciation.
There's another point I forgot in my posting: in early design phases sketching diagrams works great for me to (iteratively) get a clearer picture of a systems design. I don't think I would achieve the same effect with a graphical notation (only).
Anyway, it seems as if you are not alone:
http://www.eclipse.org/proposals/tmf/
(I was not aware of this until recently)

Best regards,
Andreas</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hello Rafael,</p>
<p>thanks for your appreciation.<br />
There&#8217;s another point I forgot in my posting: in early design phases sketching diagrams works great for me to (iteratively) get a clearer picture of a systems design. I don&#8217;t think I would achieve the same effect with a graphical notation (only).<br />
Anyway, it seems as if you are not alone:<br />
<a href="http://www.eclipse.org/proposals/tmf/" rel="nofollow">http://www.eclipse.org/proposals/tmf/</a><br />
(I was not aware of this until recently)</p>
<p>Best regards,<br />
Andreas</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on Eclipse DemoCamp in Vancouver by Andreas</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/12/08/eclipse-democamp-in-vancouver/#comment-56</link>
		<dc:creator>Andreas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Dec 2007 20:34:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/12/08/eclipse-democamp-in-vancouver/#comment-56</guid>
		<description>Hello,

since Rafael asked me here are some of my thoughts on the topic:
http://www.empowertec.de/blog/2007/12/10/thoughts-about-textuml/
Executive summary:
From the point of view of a tool vendor, using text to manipulate the structural aspects of a UML model seems not the right approach to me.
(As I understand Rafael plans to make TextUML part of a commercial product).

Best regards,
Andreas</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hello,</p>
<p>since Rafael asked me here are some of my thoughts on the topic:<br />
<a href="http://www.empowertec.de/blog/2007/12/10/thoughts-about-textuml/" rel="nofollow">http://www.empowertec.de/blog/2007/12/10/thoughts-about-textuml/</a><br />
Executive summary:<br />
From the point of view of a tool vendor, using text to manipulate the structural aspects of a UML model seems not the right approach to me.<br />
(As I understand Rafael plans to make TextUML part of a commercial product).</p>
<p>Best regards,<br />
Andreas</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on UML modes and tools by EmPowerTec UML and modeling blog &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Thoughts about TextUML</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/05/12/uml-modes-and-tools/#comment-23</link>
		<dc:creator>EmPowerTec UML and modeling blog &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Thoughts about TextUML</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Dec 2007 20:24:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/05/12/uml-modes-and-tools/#comment-23</guid>
		<description>[...] results when using the graphical approach the opposite is probably not true. And - as Rafael has written on his blog - TextUML is intended to be part of a product that will &#8220;aim at mainstream [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] results when using the graphical approach the opposite is probably not true. And - as Rafael has written on his blog - TextUML is intended to be part of a product that will &#8220;aim at mainstream [...]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on Eclipse DemoCamp in Vancouver by rchaves</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/12/08/eclipse-democamp-in-vancouver/#comment-55</link>
		<dc:creator>rchaves</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 08 Dec 2007 23:02:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/12/08/eclipse-democamp-in-vancouver/#comment-55</guid>
		<description>Ed, I think I missed your actual question about what the issues were, but it is basically the wrong assumption that if it is easier to get the big picture (no pun intended) of the model by using a graphical view, one should use a graphical view for everything.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ed, I think I missed your actual question about what the issues were, but it is basically the wrong assumption that if it is easier to get the big picture (no pun intended) of the model by using a graphical view, one should use a graphical view for everything.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on Eclipse DemoCamp in Vancouver by rchaves</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/12/08/eclipse-democamp-in-vancouver/#comment-58</link>
		<dc:creator>rchaves</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 08 Dec 2007 21:28:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/12/08/eclipse-democamp-in-vancouver/#comment-58</guid>
		<description>Ian Says:

&gt; I would have really liked to attend that event, but
&gt; the ferry ride from Victoria to Vancouver was a little
&gt; too much for me on Thursday.

Yeah, I am in Victoria too, and the ferry sure is a hassle, but it was really worth it. If you have where to stay, that helps keeping the costs down too. Next time, propose to present - it helps with the motivation. And if that is not enough, think of the free beer. :D

I completely agree with you on the graphical notation being better for showing relationships, and that the textual notation is better for detailing the classes. Going even further, I believe the graphical notation is completely unsuitable for detailing behavior, such as describing activities. You are bound to use text for that.

Thank you guys for all the interesting opinions and ideas. With all this material, writing that post on textual vs. graphical notations (and internal representation vs. user-facing notations) should be a breeze now.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ian Says:</p>
<p>> I would have really liked to attend that event, but<br />
> the ferry ride from Victoria to Vancouver was a little<br />
> too much for me on Thursday.</p>
<p>Yeah, I am in Victoria too, and the ferry sure is a hassle, but it was really worth it. If you have where to stay, that helps keeping the costs down too. Next time, propose to present - it helps with the motivation. And if that is not enough, think of the free beer. <img src='http://abstratt.com/blog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif' alt=':D' class='wp-smiley' /><br />
I completely agree with you on the graphical notation being better for showing relationships, and that the textual notation is better for detailing the classes. Going even further, I believe the graphical notation is completely unsuitable for detailing behavior, such as describing activities. You are bound to use text for that.</p>
<p>Thank you guys for all the interesting opinions and ideas. With all this material, writing that post on textual vs. graphical notations (and internal representation vs. user-facing notations) should be a breeze now.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>Comment on Eclipse DemoCamp in Vancouver by rchaves</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/12/08/eclipse-democamp-in-vancouver/#comment-57</link>
		<dc:creator>rchaves</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 08 Dec 2007 21:10:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/12/08/eclipse-democamp-in-vancouver/#comment-57</guid>
		<description>Chris Aniszczyk Says:

&gt; Being able to go between the two would be key, because than
&gt;  I could at least produce graphics for people who need a
&gt; graphical model

Oh yeah, I am with you on that one - this seems to be one of the recurring conclusions every time I see the textual vs. graphical debate.

The toolkit has a graphical viewer that is very immature/raw right now, but should look much better when I adopt &lt;a href="http://www.umlgraph.org" rel="nofollow"&gt;UMLGraph&lt;/a&gt; as the rendering engine. But it will be just a viewer, not an editor.

For a graphical editor, users will have to look elsewhere. But given that the models created by TextUML are serialized using UML2, there are a few choices of graphical tools now (such as Eclipse UML2 Tools) and there will be more in the future as UML2 gains more traction. This is not supported yet, but I plan to have an editor for TextUML that will read and save UML models natively instead of saving the source code as-is and generating the UML model as the object code, as it is now. That would allow different team members to collaborate (read/modify) on the same models using their notation of choice.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Chris Aniszczyk Says:</p>
<p>> Being able to go between the two would be key, because than<br />
>  I could at least produce graphics for people who need a<br />
> graphical model</p>
<p>Oh yeah, I am with you on that one - this seems to be one of the recurring conclusions every time I see the textual vs. graphical debate.</p>
<p>The toolkit has a graphical viewer that is very immature/raw right now, but should look much better when I adopt <a href="http://www.umlgraph.org" rel="nofollow">UMLGraph</a> as the rendering engine. But it will be just a viewer, not an editor.</p>
<p>For a graphical editor, users will have to look elsewhere. But given that the models created by TextUML are serialized using UML2, there are a few choices of graphical tools now (such as Eclipse UML2 Tools) and there will be more in the future as UML2 gains more traction. This is not supported yet, but I plan to have an editor for TextUML that will read and save UML models natively instead of saving the source code as-is and generating the UML model as the object code, as it is now. That would allow different team members to collaborate (read/modify) on the same models using their notation of choice.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on Eclipse DemoCamp in Vancouver by rchaves</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/12/08/eclipse-democamp-in-vancouver/#comment-61</link>
		<dc:creator>rchaves</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 08 Dec 2007 20:52:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/12/08/eclipse-democamp-in-vancouver/#comment-61</guid>
		<description>Ed, I am a separation of concerns freak. I find the people behind UML did a great job at completely isolating semantics from syntax. So, regardless the syntax, if the semantics is preserved, we are good. That has interesting implications:

1) multiple user oriented notations: one notation will be better than another for different people, or at different tasks. There is no point in forcing everyone to use the same notation, for all tasks. Why not use the one the best suits your personal preferences, or that is more appropriate for the task at hand?

2) decoupling between serialization format and user oriented notation: the serialization format is just that, a way a program chooses to represent information in a unidimensional way. The main requirement here is to be able to easily parse that representation, regardless the environment you are. My take is that XML is the best thing we have in that sense (XMI incompatibilities aside). In my opinion, it would not make sense to expect people to be writing TextUML (or Emfatic) parsers just to be able to load a UML (or EMF) model into memory.  Machine readability and human readability are conflicting forces, there is no way around that. Tools have needs that are very different from people and as such my take is that trying to use the same syntax for serialization and as a user-facing notation is not the right thing to do, as it will favor one kind audience at the expense of the other for no good reasons, given that the semantics is all that matters.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ed, I am a separation of concerns freak. I find the people behind UML did a great job at completely isolating semantics from syntax. So, regardless the syntax, if the semantics is preserved, we are good. That has interesting implications:</p>
<p>1) multiple user oriented notations: one notation will be better than another for different people, or at different tasks. There is no point in forcing everyone to use the same notation, for all tasks. Why not use the one the best suits your personal preferences, or that is more appropriate for the task at hand?</p>
<p>2) decoupling between serialization format and user oriented notation: the serialization format is just that, a way a program chooses to represent information in a unidimensional way. The main requirement here is to be able to easily parse that representation, regardless the environment you are. My take is that XML is the best thing we have in that sense (XMI incompatibilities aside). In my opinion, it would not make sense to expect people to be writing TextUML (or Emfatic) parsers just to be able to load a UML (or EMF) model into memory.  Machine readability and human readability are conflicting forces, there is no way around that. Tools have needs that are very different from people and as such my take is that trying to use the same syntax for serialization and as a user-facing notation is not the right thing to do, as it will favor one kind audience at the expense of the other for no good reasons, given that the semantics is all that matters.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on Eclipse DemoCamp in Vancouver by Ian</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/12/08/eclipse-democamp-in-vancouver/#comment-60</link>
		<dc:creator>Ian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 08 Dec 2007 20:18:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/12/08/eclipse-democamp-in-vancouver/#comment-60</guid>
		<description>I would have really liked to attend that event, but the ferry ride from Victoria to Vancouver was a little too much for me on Thursday.

Ed, I think the text vs. graphical notation comes down to how you want to exploit our cognitive abilities.  Humans are very good an interpreting relationships between elements when presented graphically, however, in the case of UML I think we are often more concerned with the specification of the classes rather than the relationships between them.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I would have really liked to attend that event, but the ferry ride from Victoria to Vancouver was a little too much for me on Thursday.</p>
<p>Ed, I think the text vs. graphical notation comes down to how you want to exploit our cognitive abilities.  Humans are very good an interpreting relationships between elements when presented graphically, however, in the case of UML I think we are often more concerned with the specification of the classes rather than the relationships between them.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on Eclipse DemoCamp in Vancouver by Chris Aniszczyk</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/12/08/eclipse-democamp-in-vancouver/#comment-59</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris Aniszczyk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 08 Dec 2007 16:55:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/12/08/eclipse-democamp-in-vancouver/#comment-59</guid>
		<description>Keep pushing TextUML, I personally find graphical models just confusing. I guess that's just me, I would prefer to parse a very simple textual notation over a large graphic. Being able to go between the two would be key, because than I could at least produce graphics for people who need a graphical model :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Keep pushing TextUML, I personally find graphical models just confusing. I guess that&#8217;s just me, I would prefer to parse a very simple textual notation over a large graphic. Being able to go between the two would be key, because than I could at least produce graphics for people who need a graphical model <img src='http://abstratt.com/blog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /></p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on Eclipse DemoCamp in Vancouver by Ed Merks</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/12/08/eclipse-democamp-in-vancouver/#comment-62</link>
		<dc:creator>Ed Merks</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 08 Dec 2007 12:35:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/12/08/eclipse-democamp-in-vancouver/#comment-62</guid>
		<description>I'll be interested to hear more about the issue of textual verses graphical notations.  I suppose some will argue that a picture is worth a thousand words, but even in that case, wouldn't a human readable notation as the serialized form be significantly better than semi-readable XML verbosity we have to put up with today?  It always strikes me as unfortunate the extent to which XML has stifled progress on human readable notations...

I still miss Vancouver a lot but I'll be there to visit family after the coming week's board meetings...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ll be interested to hear more about the issue of textual verses graphical notations.  I suppose some will argue that a picture is worth a thousand words, but even in that case, wouldn&#8217;t a human readable notation as the serialized form be significantly better than semi-readable XML verbosity we have to put up with today?  It always strikes me as unfortunate the extent to which XML has stifled progress on human readable notations&#8230;</p>
<p>I still miss Vancouver a lot but I&#8217;ll be there to visit family after the coming week&#8217;s board meetings&#8230;</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on The two EMFs by Ed Merks</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/12/01/the-two-emfs-and-the-beauty-of-mdd/#comment-49</link>
		<dc:creator>Ed Merks</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 03 Dec 2007 22:12:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/12/01/the-two-emfs-and-the-beauty-of-mdd/#comment-49</guid>
		<description>Jörg, I forgot to submit my comments earlier and after doing so saw your additional comments.  I guess this is confirmation that different folks will want different things, as Rafael says, so while some might want no runtime, some might use a different runtime.  In the end, many folks will have patterns that might differ wildly in their requirements and hence are specialized to their own needs.  We certainly want to ensure that we always will support this approach.  We want to enable everyone, not force everyone down the path we decide is best, as if we could possibly know that for everyone in the first place...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jörg, I forgot to submit my comments earlier and after doing so saw your additional comments.  I guess this is confirmation that different folks will want different things, as Rafael says, so while some might want no runtime, some might use a different runtime.  In the end, many folks will have patterns that might differ wildly in their requirements and hence are specialized to their own needs.  We certainly want to ensure that we always will support this approach.  We want to enable everyone, not force everyone down the path we decide is best, as if we could possibly know that for everyone in the first place&#8230;</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>Comment on The two EMFs by Ed Merks</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/12/01/the-two-emfs-and-the-beauty-of-mdd/#comment-51</link>
		<dc:creator>Ed Merks</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 03 Dec 2007 22:07:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/12/01/the-two-emfs-and-the-beauty-of-mdd/#comment-51</guid>
		<description>It's a little known fact that the EMF 2.2.x runtime works with Foundation 1.1, so it also works with J2ME.  Tom Schindl, Boris Bokowski, and I  are also working on GWT compatible version of the runtime; so far mostly Tom is doing all the work.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s a little known fact that the EMF 2.2.x runtime works with Foundation 1.1, so it also works with J2ME.  Tom Schindl, Boris Bokowski, and I  are also working on GWT compatible version of the runtime; so far mostly Tom is doing all the work.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on The two EMFs by Jörg von Frantzius</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/12/01/the-two-emfs-and-the-beauty-of-mdd/#comment-50</link>
		<dc:creator>Jörg von Frantzius</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 03 Dec 2007 09:53:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/12/01/the-two-emfs-and-the-beauty-of-mdd/#comment-50</guid>
		<description>Just to have mentioned it here, we are happily generating our own runtime code, which is not based on the Ecore runtime framework, but still provides containment semantics and bidirectional integrity of associations.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just to have mentioned it here, we are happily generating our own runtime code, which is not based on the Ecore runtime framework, but still provides containment semantics and bidirectional integrity of associations.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on TextUML Toolkit 1.0 M2 is available! by EmPowerTec UML and modeling blog &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Text based modeling with TextUML</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/09/02/textuml-toolkit-10-m2-is-available/#comment-32</link>
		<dc:creator>EmPowerTec UML and modeling blog &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Text based modeling with TextUML</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 03 Dec 2007 09:39:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/09/02/textuml-toolkit-10-m2-is-available/#comment-32</guid>
		<description>[...] some graphical editor the modeler uses a programming language to create the model. There is even an Eclipse project that supports modelers in creating TextUML [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] some graphical editor the modeler uses a programming language to create the model. There is even an Eclipse project that supports modelers in creating TextUML [...]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on The two EMFs by rchaves</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/12/01/the-two-emfs-and-the-beauty-of-mdd/#comment-53</link>
		<dc:creator>rchaves</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 02 Dec 2007 19:50:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/12/01/the-two-emfs-and-the-beauty-of-mdd/#comment-53</guid>
		<description>Thanks for the detailed comments, Ed.

&gt; my experience is that time and time again, folks who
&gt; start out saying they don’t need it now, later end up
&gt; needing it for one of the many useful capabilities it provides

When I say that there are many cases where the EMF Runtime is not appropriate, I am talking more of cases where it is not applicable/possible due to some sort of constraint. These are often technical reasons: managed objects (EJBs), constrained environments (J2ME), non-Java apps,  non-code artifacts, etc. Not to mention cases where the requirements dictate what technology is allowed to be used by the application (common if you are selling to the government).

&gt; EMF4Net proposal (http://wiki.eclipse.org/EMF4Net_Proposal)
&gt; demonstrate that the runtime is useful even in other languages.

Yes, I am pretty sure the same design would work for other languages. That for sure will expand the range of applications. Still, as in the case of Java, for other languages you will also have cases where it is not possible/applicable to use an EMF-style runtime.

&gt; In any case, folks can use EMF to generate non-EMF artifacts
&gt; and it would be relatively simple to generate POJOs.

Here you are talking about using EMF-based models and writing templates yourself, right? This is exactly how I use EMF (most of the time), and I don't think you guys should worry about this scenario other than keeping ECore as versatile as it is today. Providing generation of POJO code out of the box should be out of scope for EMF itself, although it might make sense to cover things like that in EMFT projects. The needs for code generation when the target is not the EMF runtime are so diverse that I think most users would want to have their own templates anyway.

&gt; In any case, the community has great value to me,
&gt; so I’m inclined to listen when it speaks. That doesn’t
&gt; mean I can do everything it asks.

For me, there is nothing else to be done other than preserving and evolving Ecore as an independently usable tool. Sometimes I notice features that are missing and realize that UML has. Instead of expecting more from Ecore, in those cases I think adopting the full-fledged UML2 is the best option.

&gt; The fact that a powerful core modeling technology that can
&gt; bootstrap itself can be used for unlimited purposes isn’t an
&gt; accident, it’s inherent in the model drive development paradigm.

True. But one can always decide to ignore that and deem everything outside of the initial focus as "unsupported".

&gt; You really don’t need to worry about us ever doing
&gt; anything to break out clients.

That is great. I was just not sure people using Ecore-based models for targetting anything other than EMF-runtime based Java apps were actually considered clients. I feel much better now. Thanks!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for the detailed comments, Ed.</p>
<p>> my experience is that time and time again, folks who<br />
> start out saying they don’t need it now, later end up<br />
> needing it for one of the many useful capabilities it provides</p>
<p>When I say that there are many cases where the EMF Runtime is not appropriate, I am talking more of cases where it is not applicable/possible due to some sort of constraint. These are often technical reasons: managed objects (EJBs), constrained environments (J2ME), non-Java apps,  non-code artifacts, etc. Not to mention cases where the requirements dictate what technology is allowed to be used by the application (common if you are selling to the government).</p>
<p>> EMF4Net proposal (http://wiki.eclipse.org/EMF4Net_Proposal)<br />
> demonstrate that the runtime is useful even in other languages.</p>
<p>Yes, I am pretty sure the same design would work for other languages. That for sure will expand the range of applications. Still, as in the case of Java, for other languages you will also have cases where it is not possible/applicable to use an EMF-style runtime.</p>
<p>> In any case, folks can use EMF to generate non-EMF artifacts<br />
> and it would be relatively simple to generate POJOs.</p>
<p>Here you are talking about using EMF-based models and writing templates yourself, right? This is exactly how I use EMF (most of the time), and I don&#8217;t think you guys should worry about this scenario other than keeping ECore as versatile as it is today. Providing generation of POJO code out of the box should be out of scope for EMF itself, although it might make sense to cover things like that in EMFT projects. The needs for code generation when the target is not the EMF runtime are so diverse that I think most users would want to have their own templates anyway.</p>
<p>> In any case, the community has great value to me,<br />
> so I’m inclined to listen when it speaks. That doesn’t<br />
> mean I can do everything it asks.</p>
<p>For me, there is nothing else to be done other than preserving and evolving Ecore as an independently usable tool. Sometimes I notice features that are missing and realize that UML has. Instead of expecting more from Ecore, in those cases I think adopting the full-fledged UML2 is the best option.</p>
<p>> The fact that a powerful core modeling technology that can<br />
> bootstrap itself can be used for unlimited purposes isn’t an<br />
> accident, it’s inherent in the model drive development paradigm.</p>
<p>True. But one can always decide to ignore that and deem everything outside of the initial focus as &#8220;unsupported&#8221;.</p>
<p>> You really don’t need to worry about us ever doing<br />
> anything to break out clients.</p>
<p>That is great. I was just not sure people using Ecore-based models for targetting anything other than EMF-runtime based Java apps were actually considered clients. I feel much better now. Thanks!</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on The two EMFs by Ed Merks</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/12/01/the-two-emfs-and-the-beauty-of-mdd/#comment-52</link>
		<dc:creator>Ed Merks</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 02 Dec 2007 13:28:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/12/01/the-two-emfs-and-the-beauty-of-mdd/#comment-52</guid>
		<description>Rafael, this is a well written posting.  I would argue that EMF's runtime is useful in most applications but certainly not all.  As I said on the newsgroup, my experience is that time and time again, folks who start out saying they don't need it now, later end up needing it for one of the many useful capabilities it provides.   Things like the EMF4Net proposal (http://wiki.eclipse.org/EMF4Net_Proposal) demonstrate that the runtime is useful even in other languages.

In any case, folks can use EMF to generate non-EMF artifacts and it would be relatively simple to generate POJOs.  I'm pretty sure Martin Taal has done that.  If there was significant interest in this in the community, as opposed to the occasional negative shopper easily swayed to reconsider their approach, as well as folks willing put their development resource where there mouth is, I certainly would reconsider my position.  But to me, things like supporting containment seem important even for POJO.  It's not clear if folks would still want a factory, and interface/implementation split (without which you can't support multiple inheritance), or just plain old public constructors.  Even if someone contributes an implementation, my very small team would end up needing to maintain it, so it's important folks realize that my position also needs to be guided by wise allocation of resource.

In any case, the community has great value to me, so I'm inclined to listen when it speaks.  That doesn't mean I can do everything it asks.  Certainly EMF was designed to implement the full behavior implied by Ecore's metamodel, which includes bidirectional references and containment so most definitely generating code that supports this via a runtime is EMF's primary goal.  Generating POJOs at this time is not a secondary goal, but is definitely an interesting application for Ecore, as is generating C# code, HTML documentation, or anything else you could possibly imagine.  The fact that a powerful core modeling technology that can bootstrap itself can be used for unlimited purposes isn't an accident, it's inherent in the model drive development paradigm.

You really don't need to worry about us ever doing anything to break out clients.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Rafael, this is a well written posting.  I would argue that EMF&#8217;s runtime is useful in most applications but certainly not all.  As I said on the newsgroup, my experience is that time and time again, folks who start out saying they don&#8217;t need it now, later end up needing it for one of the many useful capabilities it provides.   Things like the EMF4Net proposal (http://wiki.eclipse.org/EMF4Net_Proposal) demonstrate that the runtime is useful even in other languages.</p>
<p>In any case, folks can use EMF to generate non-EMF artifacts and it would be relatively simple to generate POJOs.  I&#8217;m pretty sure Martin Taal has done that.  If there was significant interest in this in the community, as opposed to the occasional negative shopper easily swayed to reconsider their approach, as well as folks willing put their development resource where there mouth is, I certainly would reconsider my position.  But to me, things like supporting containment seem important even for POJO.  It&#8217;s not clear if folks would still want a factory, and interface/implementation split (without which you can&#8217;t support multiple inheritance), or just plain old public constructors.  Even if someone contributes an implementation, my very small team would end up needing to maintain it, so it&#8217;s important folks realize that my position also needs to be guided by wise allocation of resource.</p>
<p>In any case, the community has great value to me, so I&#8217;m inclined to listen when it speaks.  That doesn&#8217;t mean I can do everything it asks.  Certainly EMF was designed to implement the full behavior implied by Ecore&#8217;s metamodel, which includes bidirectional references and containment so most definitely generating code that supports this via a runtime is EMF&#8217;s primary goal.  Generating POJOs at this time is not a secondary goal, but is definitely an interesting application for Ecore, as is generating C# code, HTML documentation, or anything else you could possibly imagine.  The fact that a powerful core modeling technology that can bootstrap itself can be used for unlimited purposes isn&#8217;t an accident, it&#8217;s inherent in the model drive development paradigm.</p>
<p>You really don&#8217;t need to worry about us ever doing anything to break out clients.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on Rendering UML2 models with Graphviz by rchaves</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/09/02/rendering-uml2-models-with-graphviz/#comment-36</link>
		<dc:creator>rchaves</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 24 Nov 2007 17:21:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/09/02/rendering-uml2-models-with-graphviz/#comment-36</guid>
		<description>Hi Andreas,

I am not against supporting that usage scenario (annotated Javadoc'd Java code), but that is what I think it should be: a usage scenario. Even if UMLGraph moves to an API style, the current approach still should be supported as one possible input form.

It is a matter of separation of concerns (syntax and semantics are different concerns).  Separation of concerns promotes reuse, and I always aim for reuse. High-level textual languages are for humans, not for tools. Different people like different syntaxes, even if the semantics is the same, so if the tool is strongly tied to a specific syntax notation, you are needlessly bound to have people that won't like the tool because of the language. That does not make sense to me economically and strategically wise.

UML is a great example of that: the semantics are extensively defined, and a graphical notation is proposed based on the semantics. Then, you can have a tool chain that supports UML, and one or more model creation tools that support different input notations.

Another (incidental) reason is that there are plans of covering other UML diagrams in UMLGraph (sequence diagrams are already supported), and you cannot do that with annotated Java code, so another notation is required anyway (UMLGraph uses pic for sequence diagrams).

Thanks for your comments,

Rafael</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Andreas,</p>
<p>I am not against supporting that usage scenario (annotated Javadoc&#8217;d Java code), but that is what I think it should be: a usage scenario. Even if UMLGraph moves to an API style, the current approach still should be supported as one possible input form.</p>
<p>It is a matter of separation of concerns (syntax and semantics are different concerns).  Separation of concerns promotes reuse, and I always aim for reuse. High-level textual languages are for humans, not for tools. Different people like different syntaxes, even if the semantics is the same, so if the tool is strongly tied to a specific syntax notation, you are needlessly bound to have people that won&#8217;t like the tool because of the language. That does not make sense to me economically and strategically wise.</p>
<p>UML is a great example of that: the semantics are extensively defined, and a graphical notation is proposed based on the semantics. Then, you can have a tool chain that supports UML, and one or more model creation tools that support different input notations.</p>
<p>Another (incidental) reason is that there are plans of covering other UML diagrams in UMLGraph (sequence diagrams are already supported), and you cannot do that with annotated Java code, so another notation is required anyway (UMLGraph uses pic for sequence diagrams).</p>
<p>Thanks for your comments,</p>
<p>Rafael</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on UML 101 with TextUML: the Templates package by Andreas</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/11/01/uml-101-the-templates-package/#comment-46</link>
		<dc:creator>Andreas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 24 Nov 2007 10:19:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/11/01/uml-101-the-templates-package/#comment-46</guid>
		<description>Ok, this 'incident' was enough that I invested an hour to give my blog at least a unique appearance. Demonstrating me again my design skills...oh well.
Best regards,
Andreas</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ok, this &#8216;incident&#8217; was enough that I invested an hour to give my blog at least a unique appearance. Demonstrating me again my design skills&#8230;oh well.<br />
Best regards,<br />
Andreas</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on Rendering UML2 models with Graphviz by Andreas</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/09/02/rendering-uml2-models-with-graphviz/#comment-35</link>
		<dc:creator>Andreas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 24 Nov 2007 10:14:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/09/02/rendering-uml2-models-with-graphviz/#comment-35</guid>
		<description>Hello,

ok, thanks!
But i don't get what's the problem with UmlGraph relying on Java source code. Actually UmlGraph uses just a subset and I see this subset as a domain specific language for describing UML diagrams. So, instead of controlling an object model based on some API the client code emits a piece of source code (*you* should like that :-).
Granted, this may be a bit more cumbersome and provides more potential for runtime errors but in practice it does not stop me using it (We are actually building an application that uses UmlGraph for rendering class diagrams - a UML metamodel viewer). I think it is a tiny implementation detail.
I'd prefer having a version that does not rely on an external binary (the dot program) and a Java installation (our software is .NET based).

Best regards,
Andreas</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hello,</p>
<p>ok, thanks!<br />
But i don&#8217;t get what&#8217;s the problem with UmlGraph relying on Java source code. Actually UmlGraph uses just a subset and I see this subset as a domain specific language for describing UML diagrams. So, instead of controlling an object model based on some API the client code emits a piece of source code (*you* should like that :-).<br />
Granted, this may be a bit more cumbersome and provides more potential for runtime errors but in practice it does not stop me using it (We are actually building an application that uses UmlGraph for rendering class diagrams - a UML metamodel viewer). I think it is a tiny implementation detail.<br />
I&#8217;d prefer having a version that does not rely on an external binary (the dot program) and a Java installation (our software is .NET based).</p>
<p>Best regards,<br />
Andreas</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on Graphical notation in the TextUML Toolkit by rchaves</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/05/06/graphical-notation-in-the-textuml-toolkit/#comment-5</link>
		<dc:creator>rchaves</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Nov 2007 07:31:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/05/06/graphical-notation-in-textuml-toolkit/#comment-5</guid>
		<description>An update to this:

1) Graphviz integration is part of the TextUML Toolkit &lt;a href="http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/09/02/textuml-toolkit-10-m2-is-available/" rel="nofollow"&gt;since m2&lt;/a&gt;.

2) UMLGraph integration is under way and should be ready before the end of the year.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>An update to this:</p>
<p>1) Graphviz integration is part of the TextUML Toolkit <a href="http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/09/02/textuml-toolkit-10-m2-is-available/" rel="nofollow">since m2</a>.</p>
<p>2) UMLGraph integration is under way and should be ready before the end of the year.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on Rendering UML2 models with Graphviz by rchaves</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/09/02/rendering-uml2-models-with-graphviz/#comment-38</link>
		<dc:creator>rchaves</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Nov 2007 07:28:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/09/02/rendering-uml2-models-with-graphviz/#comment-38</guid>
		<description>Absolutely not. If you looked further past in the blog, you would have seen this:

http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/05/06/graphical-notation-in-the-textuml-toolkit/

There are plans of adopting UMLGraph soon, but not before it suffering a significant surgery that will make it more useful in other contexts (UMLGraph currently only supports annotated Javadocs as input). That effort has just started (way later than initially planned). For the next milestone of the TextUML Toolkit (M3), UMLGraph should be the rendering mechanism.

Also, EclipseGraphviz is mainly about rendering graphs using Graphviz in Eclipse. The current UML class diagram rendering in EclipseGraphviz is more an example of a concrete application than anything else.

Thanks for the comments.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Absolutely not. If you looked further past in the blog, you would have seen this:</p>
<p><a href="http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/05/06/graphical-notation-in-the-textuml-toolkit/" rel="nofollow">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/05/06/graphical-notation-in-the-textuml-toolkit/</a></p>
<p>There are plans of adopting UMLGraph soon, but not before it suffering a significant surgery that will make it more useful in other contexts (UMLGraph currently only supports annotated Javadocs as input). That effort has just started (way later than initially planned). For the next milestone of the TextUML Toolkit (M3), UMLGraph should be the rendering mechanism.</p>
<p>Also, EclipseGraphviz is mainly about rendering graphs using Graphviz in Eclipse. The current UML class diagram rendering in EclipseGraphviz is more an example of a concrete application than anything else.</p>
<p>Thanks for the comments.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on UML 101 with TextUML: the Templates package by rchaves</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/11/01/uml-101-the-templates-package/#comment-48</link>
		<dc:creator>rchaves</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Nov 2007 07:19:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/11/01/uml-101-the-templates-package/#comment-48</guid>
		<description>Yes, I am guilty of the same sin (and have no plans of changing that.. :)).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, I am guilty of the same sin (and have no plans of changing that.. :)).</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on Rendering UML2 models with Graphviz by Andreas</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/09/02/rendering-uml2-models-with-graphviz/#comment-37</link>
		<dc:creator>Andreas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Nov 2007 21:22:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/09/02/rendering-uml2-models-with-graphviz/#comment-37</guid>
		<description>Hello,

I wonder how EclipseGraphviz  differs from UmlGraph (http://www.spinellis.gr/sw/umlgraph/)?
NIH syndrome?
SCNR :-)

Best regards,
Andreas</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hello,</p>
<p>I wonder how EclipseGraphviz  differs from UmlGraph (http://www.spinellis.gr/sw/umlgraph/)?<br />
NIH syndrome?<br />
SCNR <img src='http://abstratt.com/blog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' /><br />
Best regards,<br />
Andreas</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on UML 101 with TextUML: the Templates package by Andreas</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/11/01/uml-101-the-templates-package/#comment-47</link>
		<dc:creator>Andreas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Nov 2007 21:20:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/11/01/uml-101-the-templates-package/#comment-47</guid>
		<description>Well, it's wordpress default...
Implementing a custom template is on my todo list but with low priority.
Best regards, Andreas</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, it&#8217;s wordpress default&#8230;<br />
Implementing a custom template is on my todo list but with low priority.<br />
Best regards, Andreas</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on UML 101 with TextUML: the Templates package by rchaves</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/11/01/uml-101-the-templates-package/#comment-45</link>
		<dc:creator>rchaves</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Nov 2007 21:21:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/11/01/uml-101-the-templates-package/#comment-45</guid>
		<description>Funny thing: we use the same stylesheet and similar colors, so I got really confused when I went to your blog!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Funny thing: we use the same stylesheet and similar colors, so I got really confused when I went to your blog!</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on UML 101 with TextUML: the Templates package by EmPowerTec blog &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Templates aka generics aka instantiable types in UML</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/11/01/uml-101-the-templates-package/#comment-44</link>
		<dc:creator>EmPowerTec blog &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Templates aka generics aka instantiable types in UML</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Nov 2007 21:17:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/11/01/uml-101-the-templates-package/#comment-44</guid>
		<description>[...] I found another post on the same  [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] I found another post on the same  [...]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on UML 101 with TextUML: the Templates package by Andreas</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/11/01/uml-101-the-templates-package/#comment-43</link>
		<dc:creator>Andreas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Nov 2007 21:14:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/11/01/uml-101-the-templates-package/#comment-43</guid>
		<description>Hello,
maybe readers of this post are also interested in a post on the same topic on my blog?
http://www.empowertec.de/blog/2007/08/22/templates-aka-generics-aka-instantiable-types-in-uml/
Best regards, Andreas</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hello,<br />
maybe readers of this post are also interested in a post on the same topic on my blog?<br />
<a href="http://www.empowertec.de/blog/2007/08/22/templates-aka-generics-aka-instantiable-types-in-uml/" rel="nofollow">http://www.empowertec.de/blog/2007/08/22/templates-aka-generics-aka-instantiable-types-in-uml/</a><br />
Best regards, Andreas</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on TextUML Toolkit 1.0 M2 is available! by rchaves</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/09/02/textuml-toolkit-10-m2-is-available/#comment-31</link>
		<dc:creator>rchaves</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 17 Sep 2007 15:00:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/09/02/textuml-toolkit-10-m2-is-available/#comment-31</guid>
		<description>Hey, thanks for the appreciation.

Yes, an update site is planned for before the next milestone. The main reason it was not done yet was that updates are based on features, and the Eclipse UML2 feature required by the TextUML Toolkit also requires the JDT Core feature, which is totally unnecessary in the context of our toolkit. That means someone that has CDT and not JDT would have to install JDT Core before installing the TextUML Toolkit. We plan to fix that by providing a simpler feature that has only the Eclipse UML2 plug-ins we actually need.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey, thanks for the appreciation.</p>
<p>Yes, an update site is planned for before the next milestone. The main reason it was not done yet was that updates are based on features, and the Eclipse UML2 feature required by the TextUML Toolkit also requires the JDT Core feature, which is totally unnecessary in the context of our toolkit. That means someone that has CDT and not JDT would have to install JDT Core before installing the TextUML Toolkit. We plan to fix that by providing a simpler feature that has only the Eclipse UML2 plug-ins we actually need.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on TextUML Toolkit 1.0 M2 is available! by Henrique</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/09/02/textuml-toolkit-10-m2-is-available/#comment-30</link>
		<dc:creator>Henrique</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 14 Sep 2007 19:07:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/09/02/textuml-toolkit-10-m2-is-available/#comment-30</guid>
		<description>Great, just missing a Eclipse update site.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great, just missing a Eclipse update site.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on Rendering UML2 models with Graphviz by rchaves</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/09/02/rendering-uml2-models-with-graphviz/#comment-34</link>
		<dc:creator>rchaves</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Sep 2007 05:20:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/09/02/rendering-uml2-models-with-graphviz/#comment-34</guid>
		<description>Hi Ian, sorry for the delay, but I have been away on an extended long weekend.

That might work, if you think non-interactive visualizations are fine with your audience. I would be very interested in seeing others making use of the existing infrastructure and helping evolving it into a useful but minimalistic graph rendering framework. Right now the only use case pushing its development is visualization of UML models (class diagrams), which is my personal interest.

Be warned though that besides the bundling of Graphviz and the image viewing framework there is very little value in it for non-UML related applications at this point.

Let me know if you have suggestions or ideas. If you feel like contributing code, commit rights are one patch away. :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Ian, sorry for the delay, but I have been away on an extended long weekend.</p>
<p>That might work, if you think non-interactive visualizations are fine with your audience. I would be very interested in seeing others making use of the existing infrastructure and helping evolving it into a useful but minimalistic graph rendering framework. Right now the only use case pushing its development is visualization of UML models (class diagrams), which is my personal interest.</p>
<p>Be warned though that besides the bundling of Graphviz and the image viewing framework there is very little value in it for non-UML related applications at this point.</p>
<p>Let me know if you have suggestions or ideas. If you feel like contributing code, commit rights are one patch away. <img src='http://abstratt.com/blog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /></p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>Comment on Rendering UML2 models with Graphviz by Ian Bull</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/09/02/rendering-uml2-models-with-graphviz/#comment-33</link>
		<dc:creator>Ian Bull</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 02 Sep 2007 14:56:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/09/02/rendering-uml2-models-with-graphviz/#comment-33</guid>
		<description>I wonder if we should combine your work with Zest, an interactive visualization toolkit for Eclipse (http://www.eclipse.org/mylyn/zest.php).  This way we can get the great layouts of GraphViz and the interactivity of Zest?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I wonder if we should combine your work with Zest, an interactive visualization toolkit for Eclipse (http://www.eclipse.org/mylyn/zest.php).  This way we can get the great layouts of GraphViz and the interactivity of Zest?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on A detour from a detour from a detour&#8230; (or how a graphical viewing framework for Eclipse was born) by Neil</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/08/23/a-detour-from-a-detour-from-a-detour-or-how-a-graphical-viewing-framework-for-eclipse-was-born/#comment-28</link>
		<dc:creator>Neil</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 29 Aug 2007 15:47:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/08/23/a-detour-from-a-detour-from-a-detour-or-how-a-graphical-viewing-framework-for-eclipse-was-born/#comment-28</guid>
		<description>Aha!  Thanks, it's working now.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Aha!  Thanks, it&#8217;s working now.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on A detour from a detour from a detour&#8230; (or how a graphical viewing framework for Eclipse was born) by rchaves</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/08/23/a-detour-from-a-detour-from-a-detour-or-how-a-graphical-viewing-framework-for-eclipse-was-born/#comment-26</link>
		<dc:creator>rchaves</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 29 Aug 2007 03:15:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/08/23/a-detour-from-a-detour-from-a-detour-or-how-a-graphical-viewing-framework-for-eclipse-was-born/#comment-26</guid>
		<description>Hi Neil,

I think I understand what is going on now.

The image viewer is a view, not an editor. Instead of double-clicking the file, you should be able to open it by going Window &gt; Show View &gt; Other... &gt; Other &gt; Image Viewer.

Now that you have the view open, you should be able to see the images by navigating the files on the package explorer, resource navigator or project explorer.  Also, there is no special editor for DOT - the Eclipse basic text editor should do it for now.

I committed last night a fix to a bug that prevented Graphviz from working as a deployed plug-in, but if you are running from the source you should not be affected by that problem anyway. Another recent fix made the image viewer aware of files opened in an editor (before it only worked for files selected in one of the views I mentioned above). I should start versioning the repository and making an update site sometime in the near future.

About the issue with the com.abstratt.settings project, that should go away if you defined a path variable named WORKSPACE_ROOT pointing to your workspace directory (Window &gt; Preferences... &gt; General &gt; Workspace &gt; Linked resources &gt; New...).

Let me know if that works for you. Thanks a lot for trying the tool and providing feedback!

Rafael</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Neil,</p>
<p>I think I understand what is going on now.</p>
<p>The image viewer is a view, not an editor. Instead of double-clicking the file, you should be able to open it by going Window > Show View > Other&#8230; > Other > Image Viewer.</p>
<p>Now that you have the view open, you should be able to see the images by navigating the files on the package explorer, resource navigator or project explorer.  Also, there is no special editor for DOT - the Eclipse basic text editor should do it for now.</p>
<p>I committed last night a fix to a bug that prevented Graphviz from working as a deployed plug-in, but if you are running from the source you should not be affected by that problem anyway. Another recent fix made the image viewer aware of files opened in an editor (before it only worked for files selected in one of the views I mentioned above). I should start versioning the repository and making an update site sometime in the near future.</p>
<p>About the issue with the com.abstratt.settings project, that should go away if you defined a path variable named WORKSPACE_ROOT pointing to your workspace directory (Window > Preferences&#8230; > General > Workspace > Linked resources > New&#8230;).</p>
<p>Let me know if that works for you. Thanks a lot for trying the tool and providing feedback!</p>
<p>Rafael</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on A detour from a detour from a detour&#8230; (or how a graphical viewing framework for Eclipse was born) by Neil</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/08/23/a-detour-from-a-detour-from-a-detour-or-how-a-graphical-viewing-framework-for-eclipse-was-born/#comment-27</link>
		<dc:creator>Neil</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 29 Aug 2007 02:36:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/08/23/a-detour-from-a-detour-from-a-detour-or-how-a-graphical-viewing-framework-for-eclipse-was-born/#comment-27</guid>
		<description>For some reason I can't get the plugin to initialize. I have the latest source from SVN, and the plugins are present in the runtime registry, but double-clicking a jpg or .dot file in the resource navigator just launches the text editor or a system viewer. I can't see how to force the plugin to handle it. Clearly something isn't being registered properly. I'm on Windows, using Eclipse Europa (3.3).

Nothing shows up in the Error log either. The only issue I have is that when I try to checkout com.abstratt.settings, the following error occurs: "Must specify a URI scheme:WORKSPACE_ROOT/com.abstratt.settings/.settings". But I don't think this project is necessary anyway.


This is a neat project, I'd like to give it a shot. We're interested in converting our custom domain-specific language into DOT to visualize our graphs. The on-the-fly editing is really appealing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For some reason I can&#8217;t get the plugin to initialize. I have the latest source from SVN, and the plugins are present in the runtime registry, but double-clicking a jpg or .dot file in the resource navigator just launches the text editor or a system viewer. I can&#8217;t see how to force the plugin to handle it. Clearly something isn&#8217;t being registered properly. I&#8217;m on Windows, using Eclipse Europa (3.3).</p>
<p>Nothing shows up in the Error log either. The only issue I have is that when I try to checkout com.abstratt.settings, the following error occurs: &#8220;Must specify a URI scheme:WORKSPACE_ROOT/com.abstratt.settings/.settings&#8221;. But I don&#8217;t think this project is necessary anyway.</p>
<p>This is a neat project, I&#8217;d like to give it a shot. We&#8217;re interested in converting our custom domain-specific language into DOT to visualize our graphs. The on-the-fly editing is really appealing.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>Comment on A detour from a detour from a detour&#8230; (or how a graphical viewing framework for Eclipse was born) by rchaves</title>
		<link>http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/08/23/a-detour-from-a-detour-from-a-detour-or-how-a-graphical-viewing-framework-for-eclipse-was-born/#comment-25</link>
		<dc:creator>rchaves</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Aug 2007 06:16:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://abstratt.com/blog/2007/08/23/a-detour-from-a-detour-from-a-detour-or-how-a-graphical-viewing-framework-for-eclipse-was-born/#comment-25</guid>
		<description>Hi Neil,

Thanks for your interest. This is really, really in the early stages, so be ready for a bumpy ride. For instance, there is a lot of 'logging' in the form of stack traces that are just dumped to the console. Also, AFAIK, this thing has only run on my machine, so there might be lots of issues that running on a second machine would have unveiled.

Besides the quality/maturity thing, another important thing to keep in mind is that at this point Graphviz (dot) rendering only works on Windows. As the idea is that people don't have to install Graphviz, there must be a Graphviz native 